Nerdfighter Mafia

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Re: Nerdfighter Mafia

Post by saturnlite88 on Fri Jan 04, 2013 5:00 pm

Oh, whovian could save? I figured it wasn't really a tie since I would kill her.

But as Mary said, she went with precedent. I don't think a coin flip is the best ending to any game, really. We should either have 1-1 always be mafia win or town win if nothing in the game dictates it for one direction, just to prevent that from happening. If the mafia only has one person left, a 1-1 tie should happen half the time for them. Since they have fewer numbers, that puts them at a disadvantage for winning, making their last member almost useless and saying they need two remaining members to have a shot at winning. A single mafia member's chance of winning shouldn't depend on if there is an odd or even number of players in the day phase.

That said, logically, I agree a coin flip would have been how the game would have ended -- if we disregarded trying to make it fair.

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Re: Nerdfighter Mafia

Post by saturnlite88 on Fri Jan 04, 2013 5:03 pm

It also makes sense story wise most of the time. The great Saturn vs. Whovian?? No contest. Mafia has guns and what not.

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Re: Nerdfighter Mafia

Post by Blake11roys on Fri Jan 04, 2013 5:07 pm

But this situation would only happen if the last town alive is a doctor. I don't understand your last sentence because it seems to me the fairest thing here would be a coin flip.
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Re: Nerdfighter Mafia

Post by PinkSponge on Fri Jan 04, 2013 5:52 pm

I like how Statefarm just wrote a couple sentences and the rest of us wrote these huge paragraphs. And how December sent her note to me because:

DecemberHare wrote:(I didn't send this to Saturn because he's kind of an ass)
hehe That made me laugh when I read it. I bet she didn't think they'd be published afterwards.

Also, wow. I got the popular achievement two nights. That's cooler than being popular in real life, omg.

Good job, mafia. This was cool. y


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Re: Nerdfighter Mafia

Post by whoviancrochet on Fri Jan 04, 2013 8:04 pm

saturnlite88 wrote:Oh, whovian could save? I figured it wasn't really a tie since I would kill her.

But as Mary said, she went with precedent. I don't think a coin flip is the best ending to any game, really. We should either have 1-1 always be mafia win or town win if nothing in the game dictates it for one direction, just to prevent that from happening. If the mafia only has one person left, a 1-1 tie should happen half the time for them. Since they have fewer numbers, that puts them at a disadvantage for winning, making their last member almost useless and saying they need two remaining members to have a shot at winning. A single mafia member's chance of winning shouldn't depend on if there is an odd or even number of players in the day phase.

in mafia games that i have played in real life, the mafia win when they tie the number of town and the town only win if they kill all the mafia.

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Re: Nerdfighter Mafia

Post by Mary on Fri Jan 04, 2013 11:05 pm

saturnlite88 wrote:I don't think a coin flip is the best ending to any game, really.
Yeah, I would be pissed if I was playing a game and the winner came down to a coin flip. So that's what I did what I did.

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Re: Nerdfighter Mafia

Post by lucyjoan on Sat Jan 05, 2013 4:29 pm

Points and achievements for this game have been rewarded.

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Re: Nerdfighter Mafia

Post by PinkSponge on Sat Jan 05, 2013 4:59 pm

I didn't get my popularity one. wary

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Re: Nerdfighter Mafia

Post by PinkSponge on Sat Jan 05, 2013 5:00 pm

Or is there not a stamp thing for that one?

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Re: Nerdfighter Mafia

Post by lucyjoan on Sat Jan 05, 2013 5:04 pm

If you're ever confused as to whether or not a stamp exists for a particular achievement, just check out the achievements thread. If there's an image there, it exists. If there's either a string of names or nothing, it doesn't exist.

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Re: Nerdfighter Mafia

Post by saturnlite88 on Sat Jan 05, 2013 5:49 pm

Okay, since I wasn't understood, let me explain again.

If the game, on the last day phase of the game, has one mafia and one town, it could have just as easily had one mafia and two town members. It all depends on how many players signed up, how many people died each day, etc.

Now, if the mafia member is against two normal townees, if he manages to get one of them voted out he kills the other and wins. No one questions this.

But if he is unfortunate enough to play a game where the numbers are such that it's 1-1 on the last day, well then that can't work. A coin flip is just a sucky way to end any game, although perhaps the most "fair". Fair that is if you don't consider how hard it is for a mafia member to even get to this point, and how it would be possible to even win at all.

What I mean is that if there is only one mafia member left, whether or not they can win should not be determined by if there is one or two town players left. That is just cruel and unfair on it's own.

That said, in this game we had a slight derivation from this because we had a doctor. That essentially made the two town people left a one person left.

IF you don't agree, just think about it: how can it be so much easier for a last mafia member to win when there are two town members left instead of just one? It doesn't make sense. It should still be possible for them to win in this scenario. A coin flip doesn't do this justice. The town had their shot to win the game ever since he was the last mafia member and they didn't take it. Don't ruin the mafia's chance at a win just because the number is odd instead of even.

And if you think that I am just saying this because I won, you're wrong. I've always thought the mafia winning is the best option, and is why I didn't complain when I lost because of it.

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Re: Nerdfighter Mafia

Post by Mary on Sat Jan 05, 2013 6:37 pm

I just realized that I missed an achievement. Whoviancrochet should get the 50/50 achievement for surviving on Wednesday when it was tied.

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Re: Nerdfighter Mafia

Post by lucyjoan on Sat Jan 05, 2013 7:58 pm

Mary wrote:I just realized that I missed an achievement. Whoviancrochet should get the 50/50 achievement for surviving on Wednesday when it was tied.
Noted.

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Re: Nerdfighter Mafia

Post by partinobodycular on Sun Jan 06, 2013 1:59 am

I think a tie should only go to the mafia if the remaining townie(s) doesn't/don't have a role that could prevent the kill from happening overnight. If there's still a doctor, roleblocker, vig, SK, or anything else that could affect the night kill, the game should go through till morning. Coming down to a 1-1 vote ends the game based on luck, yes, but just getting to that point is kind of based on luck anyway - luck that a power role was able to stay alive long enough to get to that point.

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Re: Nerdfighter Mafia

Post by saturnlite88 on Sun Jan 06, 2013 5:34 am

partinobodycular wrote:I think a tie should only go to the mafia if the remaining townie(s) doesn't/don't have a role that could prevent the kill from happening overnight. If there's still a doctor, roleblocker, vig, SK, or anything else that could affect the night kill, the game should go through till morning. Coming down to a 1-1 vote ends the game based on luck, yes, but just getting to that point is kind of based on luck anyway - luck that a power role was able to stay alive long enough to get to that point.

I don't see what difference it makes if the last person has a power role or not, since it is the DAY phase that we are talking about.

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Re: Nerdfighter Mafia

Post by partinobodycular on Sun Jan 06, 2013 1:03 pm

The final numbers are partially determined by how well the mafia plays. Changing one lynch from mafia to town could change the rest of the game and affect the final numbers. Yes, the last mafia member had to fight to stay alive to get to the end, but EVERYONE has to fight to stay alive. Why does the mafia member deserve to win more than the townie? After all, the mafia has two chances to kill each townie, the lynch and the night kill. The town only has one chance to kill each mafia member, the lynch. In the case of a vig/SK, a townie has three chances to die, while a mafioso still only has two.

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Re: Nerdfighter Mafia

Post by saturnlite88 on Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:03 pm

Again, I don't see how "number of chances to kill" has anything to do with it. Are you saying the mafia should kill themselves or NOT kill just so a townee doesn't die and they can avoid that scenario?

I really feel this end game situation is really warped against the mafia. I don't think they deserve to win more, no, but not less either.

Let's just leave it up to the narrators. We won't be able to agree.

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Re: Nerdfighter Mafia

Post by partinobodycular on Wed Jan 09, 2013 11:50 am

saturnlite88 wrote:Again, I don't see how "number of chances to kill" has anything to do with it. Are you saying the mafia should kill themselves or NOT kill just so a townee doesn't die and they can avoid that scenario?
I'm responding to your idea that the mafia should be favored because it's harder for them to get to the end of the game due to their numbers. That's not really fair because while the mafia has smaller numbers, they also have a smaller chance of getting killed, so it's even. I don't know if this makes any sense but that's okay.
Let's just leave it up to the narrators. We won't be able to agree.
Agreed.

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Re: Nerdfighter Mafia

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